I agree with your letter to the residents regarding medic alerts. Those who have it should be thinking with their family members how they wish access to apartment to be handled if they trigger the medic alert. The co-op should not have an involvement as this is a "private emergency call" for a shareholder, but is not considered an emergency for the co-op.

AdC

I am appalled by the inhumanity of the above two forum posters.

They speak about not wanting the co-op or condo to be responsible for elderly neighbors, for fear of liability.

Yet they know very well that any competent attorney can fashion a simple form that removes that issue.

These forum posters simply don't want old people around. Old people may not aesthetically pleasing. They may, god forbid, need a hand to get across the lobby, or to get their groceries up the elevator.

Of course a frail older person wants the building staff to have access, and to be the contact person who calls for help. The building staff is there 24 hours. Friends, relatives, other neighbors may not be.

Jesus, how hard is it to call 911 or to give a freaking key to an EMS worker?

The liability issue is a smokescreen. A lawyer can create a form that frees the co-op or condo of liability.

But nothing frees each of us from the simple human responsibility of taking care of our neighbors.

I hear you.

I’m really encouraged by the dialogue, despite what one may infer from my comments.
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But, allow me to regale you about life in the insurance industry as we have experienced it
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We had a long term resident trip on the carpeting in out hallway. It is perfectly good carpeting, installed on all floors, in all hallways and well maintained. Resident sued, and insurance company paid without fighting it.
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We had a resident trip on the sidewalk outside the building because an acorn fell from a tree, maybe not even our tree. Resident broke a wrist. Resident sued. Insurance company paid.
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We had a resident who parked in our garage for many years in the same spot. One day the resident tripped when walking away from the car. The parking deck is perfectly within specifications. The resident sued. Insurance company paid.
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Why do insurance companies pay? The answer is they do a cost benefit analysis and determine the cost of paying vs. the cost of fighting.
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But then, our insurance experience file showed a number of “liability” payments. And our carrier cancelled our insurance. Assigned risk, here we come.
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What do you folks think will happen if a resident’s medic alert sends an alarm and there is delay in gaining entry to the resident’s apartment because our folks (security, doorman, etc.) are 10 seconds late (yes, try and prove 10 seconds) and someone’s survivor sues?
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As fiduciaries, we cannot allow our other 499 shareholders to be put at financial risk by a major insurance claim, not to mention the erosion of time for our highly paid board members. We pay our board members $00, twice what other buildings pay, but it still does not cover their “costs”.
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Our position is that we cannot be the penultimate respondent to a resident’s medical emergency.
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Thus, we are about to publish a letter, with essentially the information contained my original posting. If that is the form which the counter view herein poses as a solution, so be it.
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Our next step is to put the letter in our admissions package such that every buyer signs the letter.
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And I need to ask what “form” would our attorney draft other than the letter that would emerge from my posting?
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Yes, I am very empathetic to the needs o the elderly. That’s why I moved my father, now 92, to an assisted living facility in NJ from his condo in Florida. A year ago, I moved him to a nursing home as his physical prowess declined.
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Why an assisted living facility and now a nursing facility? We’ll because they are accredited to provide a certain level of service. One may argue whether they meet the commitment, and my response is that in my estimation they do.
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By the way, he has the clarity of mind to assert that he could have changed world history, maybe spent a few years in jail and perhaps ruined the family, while in prison. After all, he was the NYC police department assigned bodyguard for Fidel Castro, upon Fidel’s first visit to NYC, when he stayed at the Hotel Teresa in Harlem. Fidel offered him cigars, fried chicken and brandy
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Again, I need to repeat that we are not a nursing home or an assisted living facility. Nor are we a warehouse where children can warehouse the elderly to avoid their responsibilities in this day and age when our adults are living longer, albeit curtailed life styles. We are not Florida with endless senior citizen warehouses where parents are stockpiled by Northern children until their next dutiful visit in nine months to a year, unless death prevails sooner.
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Perhaps we can charge an extra fee for being responders to medic alerts. After all, responding, regardless of situation, its not in our proprietary lease, our bylaws or house rules. After all, why should all residents underwrite the costs of the few?
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But can you conjure the liability insurance we would incur for failure to provide an agreed and paid service.
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Folks, it’s a litigious word and as fiduciaries we cannot place our shareholders at financial risk
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Perhaps, we should sue the children of the resident needing assistance for failure to provide adequate care and for endangering the life of elder dependent.

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A well reasoned point of view and an interesting story about your father but still, you must admit, somewhat cynical and at base, detached. If we are not our brother's keeper, a nursing home will be.

ANYBODY in the building can sue over a trip-and-fall case. You're simply singling out older people. (I'm not one myself, nor have I an older friend or relative in a co-op, nor am I a lawyer, so I'm speaking as a disinterested party.) It sounds like nothing more than resentfulness that other adult children DO NOT follow lockstep with you and put their parents in a facility. That's fine for some families, but the way you do it is NOT the only way and wasn't brought down to you in tablets from the mount.

And that whole story, who knows whether it's true, advocating the assassination of a foreign leader we disagree with but with whose country we are not at war? The only relevance I can see to that tangential tale is that, taken together with your attitude toward older residents, shows a remarkably cavalier attitude toward the lives of others.

D, it's not about wanting to get rid of elderly residents -- no one ever said that, and I think you are jumping to conclusions. What's so wrong about requiring those who use a medic alert service to list neighbors, relatives or friends as a contact rather than automatically assuming the building staff is ready, willing and able to let police/EMS into their apartments?

Our building does not have 24-hour doorman coverage, but we do have an older resident who uses a medical alert service. She has a sibling who lives 30 minutes away but who cannot or will not be involved in any aspect of her care. She was recently offered a space at an assisted living facility but turned it down because she wouldn't be allowed to smoke or to use her mobility scooter there. When our older resident falls out of bed in the middle of the night, the only way the police can gain entry to the building is by pressing buzzers until someone lets them in.

Thank you, TedNJ. I will propose to our board that this older resident provide a neighbor or nearby friend as her medical alert service contact.

Very well said, Disappointed.

As a building Resident Manager, I am asked by some of my older residents about responding to the medic alert. I tell the residents that it is fine with me if they would like to put my name and number down to check on them. I think some of them don't have anyone (family members) who can check on them.

...to the resident manager above, who behaves like a reasonable and decent human being.