While I believe the board had the best interests of the Condo at heart it went a little bit overboard on the rules. If they applied common sense ( I know common sense and boards in the same senctence) then some of the rules would have passed.

MRM

Dog owners in apartments are some of the most selfish creatures on earth. Poor Fido has to use the service elevator so that he can't be snapping and tugging at the leash at other people in the passenger elevator -- and they have a problem with that? Selfish, selfish, selfish. Oh, the service elevator! How horrible! Why it's like living in a POW camp! Grow up and think about other people for a change.

You are making a GENERALIZATION like ALL Chinese people are... or ALL blondes are...

NOT every dog in apartments is the lunging snapping MUTT that you referred to MANY are TRAINED and MANY, MANY MORE (like my dog) ARE EXTREMELY WELL BEHAVED BECAUSE THEY ARE SERVICE DOGS. Service Dogs are as much a part of a HANDICAPPED PERSON as a walker or wheelchair. Would you like people with walkers & wheelchairs to also use the SERVICE ENTRANCE after all they MIGHT inadvertantly run over someone's foot or bump into them? SORRY BUT THE LAW SAYS THAT A SERVICE ENTRANCE CANNOT BE USED AS A PRIMARY (OR ONLY) HANDICAPPED ACCESS ENTRANCE. Do you know what that means? YOU CANNOT ALLOCATE SERVICE DOGS TO ONLY USE THE SERVICE ENTRANCE OR ELEVATOR because ACCORDING TO LAW SERVICE DOGS ARE DURABLE MEDICAL EQUIPMENT - CHECK OUT THE LAW & DON'T GENERALIZE

Thanks for the screaming ALL-CAPS postings. This just shows exactly the kind of fanatics so many dog-owners are.

No one is talking about ADA-protected service animals. We're talking about discretionary pets.

You know, the kind that are part of pack of eight or ten in the passenger elevator with the dog walker....

Can we all agree that dogs and children are both, at times, intrusions into our lives and leave it at that? And can we all agree that name calling is unproductive to the discussion at hand... which is how co-op boards deal with questions regarding noise, pets, etc.?

Thank you.

Agreed,its not the child,or dog rather the way they were raised or trained.

Amen

Which is getting away from the subject of having dogs use the service elevator. That hardly seems like the apocalyptic doom that crazy dog-owners made it out to be. One told the press that he would retaliate by buying three pit bulls!

All because a board trying to balance the concerns of dog-owners and non-dog-owners tried responsibly to split the difference.

Were there any dog-owners willing to compromise? To say, "Sure, the service elevator, why not? I've got a dog, it can snap at people unpredictably, it can intimidate other people in a small elevator" -- which is the intent of the pit bull guy, who clearly has emasculation issues. But no -- wah! wah! wah! Those cry-babies wanted it all their way or no way.

And the original point of this discussion had nothing to do with kids -- they only came up as a defensive false-dichotomy when dog-owners couldn't justify themselves except to vilify children. One only does that when one can't justify themselves on their own merits.

The original point of this discussion is whether dog owners should use the service elevator for their pets.

This discussion also began with a presumed dog-owner posting a gloating message that, in violation of copyright, contained an entire Daily News story.

The dog-owners on this forum (and to the screaming lady with the disability, may I point out no one here is discussing service animals, only pets) are too unreasonable to compromise and take the service elevator -- a compromise between squeezing their unpredictable animals into an elevator, intimidating and inconveniencing other riders, on one hand, and a no-pets policy on the other.

The fact that they reject a compromise designed for the good of the whole tells me they're fanatics. I've seen virtually nothing in their comments to indicate otherwise. And uncompromising fanatics are dangerous ... at the very least, they're bad neighbors.

I think it's time to drop this thread, eh?

And maybe the hyperbole, too.

I RESPONDED IN ANGER TO THE "DOG RULES" POSTER who called dog owener SELFISH but living with a disability for over 25 years that has gotten progressively worse in the last 8 years I have seen the GOOD & BAD SIDE of people when it comes to people with disabilities. "FAT" has become the new handicapped with ALMOST EVERY OVERWEIGHT PERSON possesing a handicapped parking permit & people with disabilities instead of being seen as someone that CAN function fairly equally in society with just a little help is instead seen as someone looking for a free ride. Well I would trade my motorized wheelchair for that fancy sports bike I use to ride cross country in a heart beat. I would gladly park down the block from Walmart & walk IF I COULD. I have MANY LIMITATIONS but if people could be JUST A LITTLE MORE CONSIDERATE & THINK before THEY ACT, THINK before they park in handicapped parking to "run into the supermarket" THINK before they CRITICIZE someone for being SLOW either in MOBILITY or THINKING, THINK before they criticize someone that LEGITIMATELY NEEDS A DOG to FUNCTION IN THE REAL WORLD IT IS NOT DOG OWNERS THAT ARE SELFISH BUT MANY, MANY OF THE PEOPLE LIVING IN AMONGST US THAT ARE BOTH SELFISH & INCONSIDERATE.

Do any of you realize that one day YOU COULD WAKE UP WITH MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS or have a STROKE or ANUERYSM that changes you from the HEALTHY PERSON THAT ENJOYS A 3 MILE JOG in the morning to someone that NEEDS to rely on others just to get dressed or get out of bed. ALL I AM ASKING IS THINK.

It is a SAD STATE our world is in when POLICE OFFICERS CAN ABUSE THE DISABLED FOR HAVING A SERVICE DOG IN SOCIAL SERVICES because they are IGNORANT OF THE LAW & CONDO, COOP & BUILDING OWNERS that MUST ABIDE BY STRICT LAW OF REASONABLE ACCOMMODATIONS & MODIFCATIONS (of which a Service Dog is one of them) VERBAL ABUSES or TRIES TO SKIRT THE LAW. I am a DISABILITY/ SERVICE DOG ADVOCATE in the process of forming a non profit that will RAISE AWARENESS OF SERVICE DOGS PARTICULARLY SMALL SERVICE DOGS. My goal is to make it MANDATORY that BEFORE you can OWN, MANAGE or OPERATE a CONDO, COOP, APARTMENT or ANY BUSINESS THAT YOU BE REQUIRED BY LAW to learn about the FAIR HOUSING ACT, THE AMERICANS WITH DISABILITIES ACT & THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT which covers NOT JUST the disabled but makes it ILLEGAL to DISCRIMINATE AGAINST ANYONE WHO IS DIFFERENT whether because of the color of their skin, race, disability or sexual orientation.

THERE NEEDS TO BE LESS CRITICISM & IGNORANCE ON THIS BOARD & MORE EDUCATION.

Thank you for your enlightening postings on this matter, Peggy. Hopefully they will provide boards and owners alike to reconsider the way they regard service pets and accommodating people with disabilities.

So much of the recent posts have turned into a DOGS vs. HUMAN CHILDREN debate. I have NO HUMAN CHILDREN - BY CHOICE. My Service Dog Esperanza is like my child. She goes everywhere with me, she detects changes in my diabetes, guides me away from danger so I do not fall, gets help for me when I do fall, she is ALWAYS by my side & NEVER COMPLAINS. We each wear a tag (the 2 halve kind) that says "BEST FRIENDS" on the back it reads "TOGETHER IN HEART & PAW ESPY & MOM".

As I have pointed out to MANY, MANY, MANY PEOPLE, Esperanza has been to the FINEST RESTAURANTS, CONCERTS, MOVIE THEATERS, BOAT TRIPS, MALLS, etc. & even here at the CONDO while I have witnessed parents have to REMOVE their HUMAN CHILDREN for misbehaving & causing a ruckus or they have had to stop their activities to discipline a human child I HAVE NEVER HAD TO VOLUNATRILY REMOVE Esperanza from ANYWHERE for misbehaving even when she was a tiny pup in training & while some people IGNORANT OF THE LAW asked me to REMOVE Esperanza I HAVE NEVER BEEN ASKED TO REMOVE Esperanza from ANYWHERE because of her behavior (or ANY OTHER REASON for that matter).

Esperanza can be a 1/2 a mile away running in a field playing & I call out "Espy come get in the van" she will appear out of nowhere, jump in the passenger seat floor of the van & wait patiently while I pick her up & strap her in her car seat. Once she is in the car seat she lies down & DOES NOT move until we reach our destination. It DOES NOT matter whether that destination is 10 minutes away or 3 hours away SHE LIES QUIETLY IN HER SEAT. How many children sit in their car seats for that long without moving or making a noise?

Today I was in Walmart using one of their motor carts. I suffered a severe muscle spasm in my right hand. I was in so much pain. Espy sat on my lap watching me closing & every so often she would gently lick my sore hand just for a second - trying to make it better.

With all of this said Why is it that some condo managers & boards (like mine) put such SEVERE RESTRICTIONS that SEVERELY LIMIT MY QUALITY OF LIFE yet EVERYONE ELSE in all the places mentioned above as well as a few hospitals, funeral homes etc. can have no problem abiding by THE LAW & letting us participate fully?

I want 1 person that can say (truthfully) that they have or no of a HUMAN CHILD that is as well behaved as Esperanza?

I tell people "the more people I meet, the more I love my dog".

You are lucky to have such a wonderful companion. It's hard for some people to understand the ties that bind.

When young children and dogs cry and crap all over the place. Other than that they is no comparison. Try telling your dog to do his homework, stop listening to Eminem, and to go out and play more often. Can we now move on.

The dog whisperer.

A reasonable accommodation is some exception or change that a housing provider makes to rules, policies, services, or regulations that will assist a resident or applicant with a disability in taking advantage of a housing program and/or dwelling. A reasonable modification is an alteration to the physical premises allowing a person with a disability to overcome obstacles that interfere with his/her use of the dwelling and/or common areas. The accommodation and/or modification must be necessary for the individual with the disability to enjoy and/or fully use services offered to other residents and/or the individual dwelling unit.

Reasonable accommodations can include but are not limited to:

��A change in the rules or policies or how a housing provider does things that would make it easier for you to live in the dwelling;

��Permitting a seeing eye dog for a household in a community where pets are not allowed, or not charging a deposit for a service animal though the housing provider charges deposits for pets;

��Permitting an outside agency to assist a disabled resident to meet the terms of the lease;

��Permitting a live-in Personal Care Attendant to live with a disabled resident who might need 24 hour assistance; or

��A change in the way a housing provider communicates with or gives information, such as increasing the font size of typed documents to a person with a visual impairment or providing reminders of rent due for someone with a mental disability who needs reminders.

Under the Fair Housing Act provisions, a person may keep an assistance animal as a reasonable accommodation if:

(1) the person has a disability, as defined by the Fair Housing Act,

(2) the animal is needed to afford a person with a disability an equal opportunity to use and enjoy a dwelling, and

(3) the person who requests the reasonable accommodation demonstrates that there is a relationship between the disability and the assistance that the animal provides

Service animal vs. companion animal vs. comfort animal:
A companion animal and/or comfort animal is a service animal. If there is verification of the disability and the need for the reasonable accommodation that is represented to be the presence of that animal in order for the person with the disability to enjoy equal opportunity, the companion/comfort animal is considered a service animal.

Requiring a service animal have specialized training and the tenant to submit verification of training:
A service animal does not have to receive specialized training in order to be considered a service animal. A service animal need only exhibit the ability to serve the person with the disability as is required for that person’s needs.

Under the Fair Housing Act, a person may not be denied an assistance animal because the animal lacks specialized training or does not perform tasks. Keep in mind that the animal’s owner is obligated to prevent the animal from threatening the health or safety of others and is responsible for the animal’s care and maintenance.
Under the Fair Housing Act, a person may not be denied an assistance animal because the animal lacks specialized training or does not perform tasks.

Keep in mind that the animal’s owner is obligated to prevent the animal from threatening the health or safety of others and is responsible for the animal’s care and maintenance.

Reasonable modifications can include, but are not limited to:
��A structural change or repair in your apartment or another part of the apartment complex that would make it easier for you to live in the dwelling; or

��Altering your apartment so that the unit can be accessed and used by a person in a wheelchair.

Tenants who may have visitors with disabilities:
A housing provider cannot deny the right of a tenant whose visitor/s may have disabilities from bringing his/her service animal when visiting the tenant on-site.

In 2009, of the 10,247 complaints filed with HUD and state and local fair housing agencies nationwide, about 44 percent alleged disability discrimination. Of those, about half, or 22 percent of all complaints filed nationally, alleged housing providers “failed to make a reasonable accommodation” in rules, policies or procedures necessary to afford a person with a disability the equal opportunity to use and enjoy their housing. A large portion of these complaints alleged a housing provider denied someone’s request to have an assistance animal in their housing

Good article, however, you may have left an incorrect impression regarding renvations to an apartment. The tenant pays for the renovations and must bring the unit back to its original condition when vacating. There may be special programs in New York City or elsewhere, but the
ADA is quite clear on this point. Also, while landlords are required to make "reasonale" accomodations, the key word is reasonable. Example, a landlord could not be expected to install a wheelchair ramp if it encroaches on a sidewalk. They would not have to install an elevator if the cost based on profit generated would be prohibitive. I write this merely to prevent the public from demanding accomodations that they may not be entitled to.

I guess non dog owners just don't get the fact that kids are so much less well behaved than most dogs and there are more unqualified parents than dog owners. Gee, kids in the elevator crying, throwing cheerios around, having tantrums. Selfish, selfish, selfish.

My doormat says "Dogs Welcome Children Must be on Leashes"

Children aren't straining at the leash trying to nip at you, they don't crap on the sidewalk in front of the building, they don't bark for literally hours while their owner is away at work.

And the fact that you can even compare dogs to human beings -- who will grow up to be our doctors, teachers, cops, etc. and, y'know, propagate the species -- is just remarkable. That sense of disproportion is just amazing.

They will also grow up to be our drug addicts and murderers. You give kids and their parents way too much credit.

you don't know the kids in my building!

lighten up